I am crushed....

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Re: I am crushed....

Postby whiskywheels » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:09 am

Crackle wrote:Goldencheetah is not for me. Incomprehensible and again, it doesn't install properly on my system. Turning into a bit of a headache this.


I found the same, although it was easy to import all my ST3 data, including the all important 'notes', I gave up after an hour of trying to learn how to use it. Mytouringbook was also easy to import everything to, but it wouldn't run properly or retain my rides despite despite saving them. There is some sort of issue to do with Java, but again I lost the will to live after nearly an hour.

Garmin Connect and RWGPS both have an attractive and easy to use interface, but if you import your ST3 data, it doesn't include the notes.

My Garmin Edge 820 can sync with Garmin Connect, then you can set STmobi and RWGPS to sync with Connect. My smart trainer data can be imported directly to STmobi. I can then add the notes after a ride. STmobi also has all my historical data and notes going back to 2006.

I don't like stuff being stored in the cloud, and I don't like subscription payment models, but given that STmobi does everything (albeit differently) that ST3 can, I'm reluctantly facing STmobi when ST3 finally dies. At least I've been able to export all my ST3 data as TCX, so I have a physical back up.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby whiskywheels » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:21 am

It was only Feb '18 that we were given this categorical reassurance that ST3 would continue indefinitely.
http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/sporttracks/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17902&p=92717&sid=2624f7565170a5de853ff53ad9ded188#p92715
Last edited by whiskywheels on Fri Apr 12, 2019 7:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Crackle » Fri Apr 12, 2019 7:01 am

That's disappointing but I don't hold that against them, things change. Funnily enough I just used my notes in St3 to help my son fill out a visa application as he had to remember dates he'd been out the country. A ride we did together pinpointed a particular date. I bet that wasn't envisaged as part of the original functionality!

I do use Garmin Connect and I do use it to connect with Strava and can use it with rwgps but I see these things only as a backup and a different way of viewing data, st3 is the reference, not everything makes it to the other platforms.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby IAmFedUpWithThis » Fri Apr 12, 2019 11:05 am

That's it settled for me, then, I'm going over to Garmin Connect (which I was using in parallel anyway) - thanks to runs4cache for the helpful information about Google maps, I hadn't spotted that as I was only realy using it because you're more or less forced to with recent Garmin devices. I've used the Export2Tcx plugin to transfer data (and I'm in the process of filling in the gear manually for the items I still expect to be using when ST3 expires). For anyone else thinking of doing the same, I've found that TCX files up to about 13MB (which for me is generally a month) work OK; somewhat larger ones will upload but you don't get the "finished" message, and if you're uploading multiple files at once the process hangs and you have to go back and upload the remaining ones again. It didn't take too long, even for 8 years of data!
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby thosj » Fri Apr 12, 2019 3:08 pm

I'd gladly pay the price of mobi to simply continue ST3 as is, no future enhancements, no nothing, simply keep it working as is thru Windows/Garmin/etc. changes. I won't, however, pay for mobi as it won't do what I do with equipment tracking (I've asked!) without basically starting over with 12 years of data, 7 bikes and associated equipment. If I'm starting over, I'm starting with Excel or Access. Local data, cloud back up with Onedrive/Dropbox, user supported, and I don't need to do this on my phone.

I'd prefer to use ST3 forever, but if the licensing thing is going to kill it, and admin hasn't SAID yes or no to that, then I guess I have to suck it up and use the year to figure out how I'm going to track my equipment.

My vote is for removing the licensing restriction and let us, the community, support ourselves into the uncertain future. Like we all sign a pact in blood that we won't submit a support request :evil:

Tom Hesselman
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby gregoryx » Fri Apr 12, 2019 4:17 pm

thosj wrote:I'd gladly pay the price of mobi to simply continue ST3 as is, no future enhancements, no nothing, simply keep it working as is thru Windows/Garmin/etc. changes. I won't, however, pay for mobi as it won't do what I do with equipment tracking (I've asked!) without basically starting over with 12 years of data, 7 bikes and associated equipment. If I'm starting over, I'm starting with Excel or Access. Local data, cloud back up with Onedrive/Dropbox, user supported, and I don't need to do this on my phone.

I'd prefer to use ST3 forever, but if the licensing thing is going to kill it, and admin hasn't SAID yes or no to that, then I guess I have to suck it up and use the year to figure out how I'm going to track my equipment.

My vote is for removing the licensing restriction and let us, the community, support ourselves into the uncertain future. Like we all sign a pact in blood that we won't submit a support request :evil:

Tom Hesselman



^^^^^^^^ THIS. Yes. Please!
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Crackle » Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:36 am

Another nail in the coffin yesterday. It's been 3 months since I've needed to use Sporttracks st3 due to some tendonitis but I did for the first time yesterday and the Garmin communicator plugin has fallen over. I see the advice to fix it is to import files manually, unless I'm missing something. That's a major drawback. I've signed up to trial mobi and it does do most of what I want, I'm just not keen on the interface or the idea of it being all online. I haven't yet found anything else, apart from st3, which does everything I want. Strava come closest but falls down on viewing historical data compared to st and historical data, stats and comparisons are what I look at most in st3. It's a shame st.mobi don't offered a tiered pricing strategy like Strava, I don't think I'd hesitate then, I'd just exclude all the fitness and freshness stuff.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Crackle » Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:01 am

Well I'm decided. St.Mobi isn't bad, does all I need but I don't need it and I don't want to pay an annual sub. I've ensured everything is updated to Garmin Connect and that and Strava will now suffice for me. In addition I've moved everything out of Connect in csv format and have begun updating my old database and I'll use that for summary stats and mileage tracking. I've also decided to let a lot of historical stuff go, I'm not bothered anymore.

I do really hope st3 continues in some form, it's still the best but I'm not hopeful of that but I'll continue to use mine until it no longer works.

I wish the developers luck, the support on st.Mobi is excellent and fast, can't fault that and as a product it's really good but just not for me.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby gregoryx » Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:53 pm

@Crackle, you might look at My Tour Book a bit more. I rejected it on first pass and even put some time into trying to make sense of Golden Cheetah. But the performance on GC with 4000 activities is terrible. MTB, on the other hand, runs extremely well. It's missing a lot of ST3 stuff, but so was ST when I started using it ten years ago or whatever. I think it took me a half-hour to start to appreciate the MTB stuff. It ain't bad. And the import-export is pretty robust, so if I get a solid move from ST3 to MTB, I'm confident I can move away from it later much more easily than ST3.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Crackle » Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:32 am

gregoryx wrote:@Crackle, you might look at My Tour Book a bit more. I rejected it on first pass and even put some time into trying to make sense of Golden Cheetah. But the performance on GC with 4000 activities is terrible. MTB, on the other hand, runs extremely well. It's missing a lot of ST3 stuff, but so was ST when I started using it ten years ago or whatever. I think it took me a half-hour to start to appreciate the MTB stuff. It ain't bad. And the import-export is pretty robust, so if I get a solid move from ST3 to MTB, I'm confident I can move away from it later much more easily than ST3.


I just couldn't get it to work. It came up with an Eclipse error. I briefly looked at it and tried a few things without success. I'm quite happy to sacrifice a few things which were really only nice to have's and see. St3 and mobi both do a lot more than I need and as my mate said on the phone...."you have 10 years worth of data. Why do you need it?" And the truth is I don't, I'm purely a recreational athlete.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby thosj » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:24 am

A question for those who've tried, do either Golden Cheetah or MyTourBook track equipment? That's the only thing I "need". Like Crackle said, I've got 12 years worth of data in ST3 I don't need. Alas, the equipment tracking I DO need and will figure out somehow, Excel, ProBikeGarage if he'll add an extra use field for mileage when setting up a piece of equipment, something. I actually need equipment tracking, or at least think I do, and mobi doesn't do it like I do it in ST3, so I'd need to start anew with a new account in mobi. Mobi would probably work going forward with a new account, adding 7 bikes and all the associated equipment anew, but I must say I'm reluctant to put in the work, and pay for the privilage, after the abandonment of ST3. Currently THAT is leaving a less than savory taste in MY mouth.

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Re: I am crushed....

Postby gregoryx » Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:16 am

@thosj, My Tour Book works for that and it imports all the info from ST3 .fitlog export. Out does it as tags, though, so mileage is there but we lose comments on the equipment itself.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby ViDi0T » Wed Apr 17, 2019 10:50 pm

whiskywheels wrote:The crazy thing is, I'll stop my subscription with ST mobi because of this. The only reason I have mobi is that it syncs with ST3! In future I can finish a ride & my Garmin 820 will sync with Garmin Connect and RWGPS as it does now, but without ST3 there's no need for mobi.


Same for me. Only paid for Mobi to sync with ST3. Way to much functionality missing from Mobi.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby whiskywheels » Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:23 am

texmurphy wrote:Export of multiple activities is supported by Export2TCX plugin http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/sporttr ... tcx-export
You will get activity trackpoints only, not Notes, Equipment, etc.
But you can import this into garmin/strava, etc.
Some programs claim to import ST3 fitlog, but they don't do it well.



I found that tcx files, imported to MyTourbook for example, were missing all the power data, weather/temp., and all the ride names/location, although my ride notes were there.

Fitlog files imported to MyTourbook do at least show everything.............except my power data :(

I tried Golden Cheetah, but that was even worse for missing fields.

I'll probably carry on with STmobi, and can at least continue to access my 13 years of data from there, but I still want an offline backup of all my data.

Who knows how long mobi will be available for? After all, it was only Feb. 2018 that we were told; (see viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17902&p=92717&sid=2624f7565170a5de853ff53ad9ded188#p92715)
" If you've purchased a ST3 license in the past, you can be confident that your license will not expire or terminate and that we will continue to make the software available for download as you need to re-install it or move it to a new machine. Licensed customers will continue to be supported via email and our social media channels, as they have for the last 15 years. That is a commitment we are making."
Last edited by whiskywheels on Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Crackle » Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:28 am

As a general principle, I'm sick of paying for software that goes end of life and stops working: I mean, I've paid for it ffs! It's like someone coming and taking an out of print book off your shelf.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby thosj » Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:08 am

Crackle wrote:As a general principle, I'm sick of paying for software that goes end of life and stops working: I mean, I've paid for it ffs! It's like someone coming and taking an out of print book off your shelf.


Frankly I used to have this opinion, too, but since phones became popular it seems "subscription" software has a better chance of surviving. I suppose because it has an income stream. I paid like $40 for ST3 YEARS ago, I think it was actually "free" or "shareware (remember THAT?) when I started using it, but I paid when it became optional, I think, and never paid again. That's why my comment in the thread above, "I'd pay Mobi (subscription) price for ST3 now." I'd have paid a couple more $40's over the years to keep it going if that'd have worked!!

I DO agree with the part "I paid for it at THEIR choice of payment method, I should be able to continue to use 'my' software." I'd probably keep using it if they took the licensing stuff out so I could install on new computers as time marches on, and remove the Mobi sync feature so they don't have to support it. Probably won't happen!

I've explored the options being mentioned here and none appeal. ProBikeGarage would work, I think, if it had a field for initial miles on components. My Strava data only goes back 2.5 years where ST3 goes back 12 years, so no way to just put my bikes on rides in Strava, put equipment on said bikes in ProBikeGarage and be done. I've contacted the author and he said he was going to fast track that option, so maybe. The others, MTB and GC, don't appeal at all.

Soooo....after much whining and consternation after the ST3 end of life announcement, I re-upped mobi, contacted them and had them wipe my account, disconnected mobi from ST3 following their instructions. My mobi account was cluttered with years of equipment that looked like a mess so I started over in mobi. Took a half a day to recreate 7 bikes and associated equipment in mobi, but it looks and works good and I de-cluttered a lot of my life keeping track of crap I found I no longer care about and was just doing because I had been doing it that way for years. I will move forward doing both ST3 and mobi, disconnected from one another, until such a time I no longer deem it fun, settling on one, which seems like mobi right now. If in 3 years mobi shuts down, woe is me, but by then I'll be 75 and might give up on all this "tracking" and just ride my damn bikes. :?:

Tom
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby ACree » Thu Apr 18, 2019 11:23 am

whiskywheels wrote:
texmurphy wrote:Export of multiple activities is supported by Export2TCX plugin http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/sporttr ... tcx-export
You will get activity trackpoints only, not Notes, Equipment, etc.
But you can import this into garmin/strava, etc.
Some programs claim to import ST3 fitlog, but they don't do it well.



I found that tcx files, imported to MyTourbook for example, were missing all the power data, weather/temp., and all the ride names/location, although my ride notes were there.

Fitlog files imported to MyTourbook do at least show everything.............except my power data :(

I tried Golden Cheetah, but that was even worse for missing fields.

I'll probably carry on with STmobi, and can at least continue to access my 13 years of data from there, but I still want an offline backup of all my data.

Who knows how long mobi will be available for? After all, it was only Feb. 2018 that we were told; (see viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17902&p=92717&sid=2624f7565170a5de853ff53ad9ded188#p92715)
" If you've purchased a ST3 license in the past, you can be confident that your license will not expire or terminate and that we will continue to make the software available for download as you need to re-install it or move it to a new machine. Licensed customers will continue to be supported via email and our social media channels, as they have for the last 15 years. That is a commitment we are making."


Yeah. It's almost like they're just pissed that the desktop users haven't 'seen the light' and moved to .mobi.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby Dyno » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:08 am

whiskywheels wrote:It was only Feb '18 that we were given this categorical reassurance that ST3 would continue indefinitely.
http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/sporttracks/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17902&p=92717&sid=2624f7565170a5de853ff53ad9ded188#p92715


If the mobile aspect is a deal breaker, or you check it out and think... meh... and decide to stick with ST3 - that is totally fine. Know that we aren't going anywhere or terminating ST3 licenses. It's your choice which option you want to use.


Pfffft!
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby whiskywheels » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:21 am

Dyno wrote:
whiskywheels wrote:It was only Feb '18 that we were given this categorical reassurance that ST3 would continue indefinitely.
http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/sporttracks/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17902&p=92717&sid=76988ce40d25974b1676d210a021a275#p92715


If the mobile aspect is a deal breaker, or you check it out and think... meh... and decide to stick with ST3 - that is totally fine. Know that we aren't going anywhere or terminating ST3 licenses. It's your choice which option you want to use.


Pfffft!


Is this satire or irony?
I've been subscribing to mobi for 6 years. If ST3 is to be no more, then I'll probably continue with mobi, and use MTb as an offline archive.
Are you saying that ST3 will continue to work after March 2020, and if so will cloud sync still work?
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby thosj » Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:44 am

"Is this satire or irony?"

Irony
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby whiskywheels » Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:52 am

:lol:
thosj wrote:"Is this satire or irony?"

Irony
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby dodgy » Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:06 pm

For those concerned about tracking equipment usage, Sporttracks does at least make it very easy to export all your data into a spsreadsheet friendly format.
Simply select the equipment tab, and right click on the first entry and select copy then paste into your preferred document, I'm using Excel.
You don't need to highlight multiple items, it couldn't be easier.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby thosj » Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:17 pm

Hmmm.... at least for me, equipment attached to other equipment doesn't come into the spreadsheet. Like a tire or chain attached to a bike. And I don't see a way to get those, no matter where you right click/copy, you get all the top level equipment and that's all. THAT won't work for me!!
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby dodgy » Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:26 pm

Damn, you're right. It does list all equipment tagged as 'not in use' exhaustively. But like you say, only top level items. For instance I have tyres 'part of' a wheel, but only the wheel is listed.

Sorry folks.
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Re: I am crushed....

Postby dodgy » Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:33 pm

Not as bad as feared. If you expand all the items in the equipment view, highlight the first item, press shift (keep it down) then highlight the last, the entire equipment list can be exported.
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