Training Load

by mechgt

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Version:

2.0.7

Updated:

Aug 26, 2015

Enhancement Suggestion

Enhancement Suggestion

Postby the5krunner » Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:51 pm

I often have ideas. For every 9 bad ones there's normally another gem in there. Please feel free to ignore!

I'm tapering at the moment and looking at the FORECAST TSB curve. Very useful. Shame it's peaking a week after race day in my case!

However what would be useful is if i could compare the current forecast with a FORECAST (Not actual) of some point in the past. IE with another similar day in my historic schedule the same number of days before an historic event. That way I can get a feel of how effective my current taper plans might be. (Currently I believe the race date only affects the Training Influence curve)

A follow on enhancement from that would be as follows (sy if i don't explain it properly pleas let me know if it is nonsense)

1. Set an historic race date and set an historic comparison point before that race date (probably either start of taper period or start of peak period)
2. Produce a forecast curve on EVERY day between these point. (maybe don't show these curves on the graph but calc the info)
3. For each of these forecast curves check how they impact on the TSB ON RACE DAY ie has it got better or worse
4. Remember the actual race day TSB
5. Show a bar (or some other visual device) that shows which days in the period contributed to a better or worse TSB

The benefit of this would be that clearly some peak/taper days will impact negatively on race day. If following a similar plan for the next race then you would know which sessions to hold back on and which ones to up a bit.

Maybe the info is already there with TSB before and after? Maybe some custom measure in ST3 could be used instead???? don't really know

Does that make sense?
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby BigMike » Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:57 pm

I should know better than to chime in on these sorts of things, but here goes!

I think the forecast TSB forecast curve is based on an extreme taper- i.e. zero daily TRIMP until your target day. You are probably trying to taper in a way that maintains your fitness in such a way that you are in a better position to train and race in additional events after your target event, so you want to continue to train until race day (so your actual TSB curve won't follow the forecast). Any day that your TRIMP exceeds your CTL, your TSB will get worse. If TRIMP is less than CTL (especially an 'off' day), your TSB (recovery level) will improve).
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby the5krunner » Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:40 am

bigmike...yes it seems that way.
however it could be our flawed training plans that get us to that position at the start of the taper.
mechgt i think is using someone else's formula so he is just putting into action someone else's research


anyway back to the enhancement suggestion....
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby mechgt » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:01 am

I think the influence curve does exactly what you're asking for, but you still need to do some legwork to interpret it. On the zero day, it's mathematically neutral with respect to race day. A day earlier is positive, and a day later will give you a lesser TSB than would be attained by doing nothing. TSB can still increase after workouts on these dates as bigmike stated, but it'll be less than otherwise possible from doing nothing. Each day closer to race day TSB is mathematically more and more negatively impacted by training as shown by the crashing INF line as it approaches race day.

You can move the INF line to various race dates (in the past for example), and each point on the INF line gives you an 'impact' gauge as to what training on that day does to your TSB. The peak day is the most helpful date (biggest boost to CTL with time available for ATL to recover), and past the zero date where INF crosses the x-axis and goes negative is negatively impactful to TSB on the scheduled race date.
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby the5krunner » Thu Apr 26, 2012 4:58 pm

i'm suggesting something subtly different and probably not explaining it well. I'm even confusing myself today :D

I want to see HISTORICAL FORECAST TSB...not historical actual TSBs

then within the HISTORICAL FORECAST CURVEs (of which there would have been one for each day) what the FORECAST TSB on the historic race day would have been.

eg today = 1st jan 2012 start of 2 week taper
race day = 15th jan

D1 = start of comparison period taper 1st June 2011
D15 = comparison race day 15th June 2011

on D1 1jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 35
on d2 2jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 36
on d3 3jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 38
on d4 4jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 32
on d5 5jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 28
maybe from D6 to D15 the race day forecast TSB then fell slowly to 20

so now I can look at my last taper and see what seemed to go right (the first 3 days) and what seemed to go wrong (the rest)
so, in the taper this year I can perhaps cut down on, say, those sessions that caused my TSB to fall perhaps too rapidly last time.

I'm sure this does give 'something' extra using the same data set and calculation. Whether it's worth the extra coding I don't know. :)

Just a thought !
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby mechgt » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:50 pm

What would be used to forecast the data? When you say forecast for each day, do you mean "show the curve as if you did not do any workouts between today and race day"? ... or are there supposed to be workouts considered in the forecast?
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Re: Enhancement Suggestion

Postby the5krunner » Tue May 01, 2012 7:15 am

Q: what data would be used:
A: "d4 4jun the value of forecast inf on 15/6/11 was 32" in that example it would be the forecast as if today were d4 ie 4th June 2011 ie the history up to and only including 4th June 2011 and no more.

Q: "show the curve as if you did not do any workouts between today and race day"?
A: Yes, sort of !!, more precisely: as if no workouts between D4 and 15/6/11 (or generically between Dn and RaceDay - where n is number of days after start f the comparison period)





[ another benefit of this feature would be that to properly use it you would probably have to activate the plugin to get access to the history beyond 45 days ;-) ]
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