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Chart heart rate vs pace for selected activies

PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 6:25 am
by stavros
I'd like to be able to display a chart plotting average heart rate vs average pace for selected events. Has anyone tried or interested in trying a plugin to show this?

I have done this in Excel using a scatter chart and found it useful confirming trends over time. E.g. If you plot a correlation line and add a new point, you get feedback regardless of what pace you run at by seeing how fun under or over the correlation line you fall. Make sense?

PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:27 pm
by foiled
+1

There used to an addon for ST1 that produced just that, it even examined the gradient and so just included the flat(er) sections of any run, to get a more useful correlation between hr and pace.

It was very useful to compare the correlation over months or seasons, to give visual feedback of improvement.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 3:54 am
by 7270martin
+1

if anyhow possible, not just pace vs. gradient, but user selectable (e.g. heart rate vs. gradient, gear vs. gradient for biking etc.)

PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 5:37 am
by old_man_biking
I could integrate this into my Activity Documentation and Reporting plugin as another type of report.
I already have an XY chart component in my Power Analysis plugin and I think it won't be too much effort to adapt this.

I'd create a documentation component that would let you select arbitrary parameters for the X and Y axis. So you can try and analyze whatever correlations you're interested in.

Cheers,
OMB

PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 9:05 am
by 7270martin
Would be very cool to have it in your activity documentation plugin!!


If analyzing only a single activity, it would be perfect to have the dots of the scatter chart colorized based on time elapsed (as you already did in your great power analysis plugin).

Or maybe in addition/as an alternative: colorization based on a third, user selectable parameter? e.g. x: grade; y: gear (by mechgt); z(color): cadence range

PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:37 pm
by old_man_biking
Two first screen shots of work in progress:

The config dialog for the component
Image

The resulting component:
Image

Cheers,
OMB

PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 10:52 pm
by stavros
Sounds good OMB.

Will I be able to select specific activities and plot data points just for those activities? In the config dialog it looks like I can only select a date range. I would like to see performance over time for a couple of specific routes that I use for assessing fitness, but want to ignore all other events.

Not critical, but it would be nice to have an option to display the date of an activity next to the plot point. I can't do this in an Excel scatter diagram so would be a nice feature.

I look forward to seeing the output. I'll have to install the Activity Documentation plugin. :D


*** I just noticed someone else posted the same request earlier this month. Apologies for duplicating ***
http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/SportTracks/Forums/viewtopic.php?t=7141

PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 2:09 am
by old_man_biking
You can filter by:
- date range and
- activity category

Due to the basic concept of the plugin it doesn't make sense to select single activities. But the category filter should help you to achieve what you want to do.

Cheers,
OMB

PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 5:04 am
by 7270martin
The correlation report and the component look very nice!!! Due to you plugin writers, the development of ST is just amazing! Thank you alot!!

Would it be possible to colorize the dots based on time (e.g. per week/month a separate color, with a color legend above or below the scatter chart)? Or maybe based on a user selectable, third parameter (e.g. average cadence)?
What about 'name' as another filter (next to date range/activity type)?



Regarding analyzing single activities:

I agree, this is not in line with the concept of the reporting function of the activity documentation plugin, as its anlysis is based on a period of time.

However, the new version of wko+ also allows a correlation analysis of an individual activity, see http://support.trainingpeaks.com/traini ... graph.aspx

Would be very cool to have this also in ST: a plugin for a user selectable correlation analysis of a single activity.
(with colorization of dots, based on time elapsed or a third paramter, and an elevation profile, which allows to select only a part of the activity)

It would be absolutely fantastic if this could be done in combination with the great filtered statistics plugin by PissedoffCil. Then you could specifically analyze the interesting parts of the activity (e.g. only uphill, only downhill etc., within a certain cadence range etc.)
-> This would go far beyond the possibilities of wko+ (e.g. gear analysis is already integrated in ST-filteredstatistics, but unknown in wko+, no grade analysis in scatter chart of wko+, no combination of filters in wko+ etc.).

Maybe OMB and PissedoffCil can talk to each other?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:30 am
by stavros
7270martin wrote:Regarding analyzing single activities:
I agree, this is not in line with the concept of the reporting function of the activity documentation plugin, as its anlysis is based on a period of time.

However, the new version of wko+ also allows a correlation analysis of an individual activity, see http://support.trainingpeaks.com/traini ... graph.aspx


I think OMB understood what I meant. I wasn't suggesting analysis of a single activity as shown in your link. Rather, I wanted to manually select a small number of activities - say 10 - and see 10 plot points on the scatter diagram of Avg HR vs Avg pace. I think I can still achieve this though by recategorising my 'baseline' activities to a new category and run the report for that category.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:52 am
by mechgt
Will these charts only be viewable when a 'documentation' has been generated, or will it be possible to see it as part of the UI in ST (like all of the other charts)? Another way of asking this is will the chart be simply a screenshot pasted into the HTML documentation, or will it be interactive like the Power plugin it is based on?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:51 am
by old_man_biking
7270martin wrote:
Would it be possible to colorize the dots based on time (e.g. per week/month a separate color, with a color legend above or below the scatter chart)? Or maybe based on a user selectable, third parameter (e.g. average cadence)?
What about 'name' as another filter (next to date range/activity type)?
...
Maybe OMB and PissedoffCil can talk to each other?


Current work in progress:
Image

PissedOffCil and I talk to each other quite often :)

PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:54 am
by fellrnr
Did this plugin get published?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:44 am
by old_man_biking
I'm still working on this feature, but it won't take longer than a week or max. two.

Cheers,
OMB

PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:19 am
by mazoaguirre
sounds impressive as usual OMB Thanks for the efforts

Pace vs Heart Rate vs Grade

PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:34 am
by kapoguy
I'm fairly new to SportsTracks and tracking so much info since I've only had my Forerunner 305 for a short time, but it seems to me that plotting pace vs heart rate for a given grade (or grade range) would be extremely useful to understand the effect of elevation changes while running on hills where I live. Usually, pace slows down a lot as I run up a hill while heart rate rapidly increases and this would not show up in a simple pace vs heart rate plot. A variation of this would be to plot pace vs grade for a given heart rate. I have found that most training approaches are based on pace, but they do not account for running on hills which greatly affects pace and heart rate. A correlation between pace, heart rate, and grade would allow one to find an "equivalent" pace (or paces) for training on certain courses that are not flat. Currently, I primarily use only heart rate zones for training, but it doesn't give me a good idea of what my pace might be on a flat course because going uphill hurts pace a lot more than what is gained by going downhill. Just some ideas.

PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:21 am
by 7270martin
Would be amazing, if such a period based scatter chart could be combinded with the filtered statistics plugin, where you can define per activity an individual set of filters (e.g. show average values for all sections within a certain grade and/or speed range).

Activity Documentation Plugin should then present all filtered average results on a activity-level in a period-based scatter chart.

For an easy user interface in the Activity Documentation Plugin, it should be enough if the user could select the templates defined in the filtered statistics plugin.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2010 4:49 am
by stavros
old_man_biking wrote:I'm still working on this feature, but it won't take longer than a week or max. two.

Cheers,
OMB


Maybe just a little bit longer than a week? Really, I'm not impatient! Maybe I need to increase my donation...
:wink:

PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2010 11:46 am
by old_man_biking
Oh these relativistic time dilation effects!
I'm moving so fast these days, that time nearly stands still 8)

Correlation

PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 10:48 pm
by stavros
OMB - It would appear that I have been suffering relativistic time dilation effects similar to those you referred to earlier this year... I've only just got around to trying out your correlation tool.

My conclusion? Awesome! :D Especially your approach to listing, colour coding and selecting activities. Certainly exceeded my expectations.

One question... When I select an activity with no heart rate data, it is plotted with an apparently arbitrary heart rate. See the selected data point in the image below. Is this a feature or a bug?


Image

Thanks again.