[ST3] Performance on startup

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[ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Sun Nov 06, 2016 3:11 pm

SOLUTION EDIT: It's the TRAININGLOAD PLUGIN that is causing the slowness. It runs and calculates when the database is opened
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I'm getting slow startup performance even with a SSD and 6GBRAM. I appreciate other archive and PC config options available to me.

I have a largish database covering several years.


My specific question is about CPU usage.

ST3 appears to be only using one of my CPUs on a relatively old Intel Core 2 6600 win10 64bit 2.4GHz

Is that known behaviour and/or is there any way I can get it to use the other core?

thank you!!
Last edited by the5krunner on Fri Apr 05, 2019 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby texmurphy » Sun Nov 06, 2016 7:53 pm

No way to get it to use other cores.
The Core 2 6600 is from 2006, might be time for an i5 upgrade, (or maybe a roll back to Win 7 from Win 10?)
Some old blogs talk about overclocking the 6600 to 3.5

Nearing end of year, so I need to think soon about yet another logbook split...
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby tndmbkr » Mon Nov 07, 2016 6:21 am

I have reread a lot of posts with respect to OOM (Out of Memory problems)
And I wondered whether it would be possible to reduce memory load by assigning key tags to an activity, and deleting a lot of datapoints.

I will try to explain what I mean.
I want to have a large logbook with all of my activities at my disposal just because of Training Load, Equipment Usage, and finding old activities which satisfy one or two key tags.
I do not need a large logbook of all activities for a detailed analysis of just one activity.

I am thinking of creating a logbook for every activity, apart from an overall logbook with all activities.
The overall logbook contains some basic data with just enough data to calculate TRIMP, TSS, equipment usage, plus key tags such as Location+Name of the activity.
The logbook per activity has the complete GPStrack, the complete data tracks for speed/power/..., etc.


Will this strategy help to reduce OOM problems?
Has anyone tried this to do before?
I can foresee some problems, such as ST trying to calculate speed and distance from the GPStrack.
But speed will not be a key tag for me.
Distance on the contrary is information necessary for equipment usage.
And of course Trails plugin will need an overall logbook.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Mon Nov 07, 2016 9:19 am

texmurphy wrote:No way to get it to use other cores.
The Core 2 6600 is from 2006, might be time for an i5 upgrade, (or maybe a roll back to Win 7 from Win 10?)
Some old blogs talk about overclocking the 6600 to 3.5

Nearing end of year, so I need to think soon about yet another logbook split...


yeah I have other higher spec PCs i5/i7 but this is the one it makes sense to use ST3 on.

is it a .net problem or something underlying? could even part of that not use the spare core. put another way, what exactly is the problem :-) ?
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby texmurphy » Mon Nov 07, 2016 2:49 pm

I believe a lot of the limitation is .net and that ST3 is compiled as a 32bit .net task. Hence the OOM issues.
.net is also slow and arbitrary on its garbage collection processing. Garbage collection can greatly interfere with the application speed of ST3.
For example, to start Reports over the entire logbook, it is best to do it after load of logbook, get a cup of coffee and work on that woodworking project for a while. Then come back to ST3 and do what you want to do. Yet always schedule a break before any significant logbook activity - like saving a large logbook - to give garbage collection time to finish.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Tue Nov 08, 2016 12:51 pm

I've read this 'solution' is rubbish . But both cores seem to work now ie i'm getting more than 50% on ST3.1 startup with EVERYTHING else closed.

System Configuration --> Boot --> Advanced Options --> uncheck "Number of processors" and also uncheck "Maximum Memory" . Click OK and reboot. System should come up with correct number of logical processors

doesn't seem any faster, mind you!
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby ksherman » Tue Nov 08, 2016 4:11 pm

I wonder what makes the difference in the user data area. I have 7 years in one logbook, 1905 activities, 2148 hours and 40,892 kilometres. Apart from a 3 second loading logbook startup I don't have any issues. I don't use power though and only have around 15 custom datafields.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Tue Nov 08, 2016 5:40 pm

it is the machine. for me and my data, I suppose I have got a lot of rubbish I don't need in it.
on another machine all is good.
just on my '5krunner' machine it is SLOW starting up and trainingload is SLOW as well. all other (basic) operations that I do are fine in st.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby texmurphy » Tue Nov 08, 2016 5:43 pm

Power results in 1 second recording. If "smart recording" averages 5 or 6 seconds than you have about a fifth the data density in your logbook.
Plus a power track being filled.
The Compress Data Plugin reduces density by about 30%.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:03 pm

yep it's compressed already.
there's all the running dynamics nonsense in there as well probably,
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby philipshambrook » Thu Nov 10, 2016 1:39 am

I get this often enough to be annoying, but then I find it's bloody Windows doing something in the background.
o__ o__
.>/-.>/
( )\---\( )
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Sat Dec 22, 2018 6:00 am

ksherman wrote:I wonder what makes the difference in the user data area. I have 7 years in one logbook, 1905 activities, 2148 hours and 40,892 kilometres. Apart from a 3 second loading logbook startup I don't have any issues. I don't use power though and only have around 15 custom datafields.


hmmm.
following on from all the above points
AFAIK I have compressed, defragged and deleted and archived all i can

My ST3.1 database goes back to Jan2017 and it takes MINUTES to load up. (i have an 8core i5 and oodles of memory)

so i can't see anything else i ca do to the environment.

Q: I uses lots of data from things like run power, smo2, cda .... might those have created extra space in the database that is used inefficiently (eg is there a running power field left blank against cycling activities)
Q: Can I SELECTIVELY delete those extra fields from the database entirely?
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby texmurphy » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:27 pm

the5krunner wrote:...
Q: I uses lots of data from things like run power, smo2, cda .... might those have created extra space in the database that is used inefficiently (eg is there a running power field left blank against cycling activities)...

My current logbook holds the last 2.5 years of cycling data with 1 second record with power, HR, CAD. My load time is under a minute.
Win7Pro64 Xeon W3680 @ 3.33 Mhz on P6x58D-E OC'ed 12 GB booted from ST240GB SSD.
If you are not using an SSD then I recommend highly an SSD upgrade to improve load times.
Start ST3 (program load of ST3&.Net) = 8 seconds - would be nice if ST3 would display a splash window to know if load has started!
Load Logbook (initial screen paint to full display of current week and day activity specifics) = 33 seconds.
Current Logbook:
* Size=269,546 KB
* Activities= 1,071
* GPS Data Points= 8458427
* Data Track Measurements= 34582715
* GC Total Memory = 469379516
Windows Resource Monitor Working Set = 662696 KB at ST3 idle

Every month's end I use Admin's Compress Plugin which shrinks data points by about 33%. This is lossless for ST3 since ST3 assumes the last datum persists over trackpoints until it changes. I.e. if heartrate is 148 at time t=100 and the next change is 149 at t=120 then the rate was 148 for 20 seconds.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:01 am

texmurphy wrote:
the5krunner wrote:...
Q: I uses lots of data from things like run power, smo2, cda .... might those have created extra space in the database that is used inefficiently (eg is there a running power field left blank against cycling activities)...

My current logbook holds the last 2.5 years of cycling data with 1 second record with power, HR, CAD. My load time is under a minute.
Win7Pro64 Xeon W3680 @ 3.33 Mhz on P6x58D-E OC'ed 12 GB booted from ST240GB SSD.
If you are not using an SSD then I recommend highly an SSD upgrade to improve load times.
Start ST3 (program load of ST3&.Net) = 8 seconds - would be nice if ST3 would display a splash window to know if load has started!
Load Logbook (initial screen paint to full display of current week and day activity specifics) = 33 seconds.
Current Logbook:
* Size=269,546 KB
* Activities= 1,071
* GPS Data Points= 8458427
* Data Track Measurements= 34582715
* GC Total Memory = 469379516
Windows Resource Monitor Working Set = 662696 KB at ST3 idle

Every month's end I use Admin's Compress Plugin which shrinks data points by about 33%. This is lossless for ST3 since ST3 assumes the last datum persists over trackpoints until it changes. I.e. if heartrate is 148 at time t=100 and the next change is 149 at t=120 then the rate was 148 for 20 seconds.



yep i use the compress tool and have a properly optimised SSD. as said earlier not all my CPU cores appear to be being used and i reckon that is the prob with the hardware (welll .net being unable to use it) but in terms of internal database config maybe its the CIQ fields?
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Fri Apr 05, 2019 3:03 pm

It's the TRAININGLOAD PLUGIN that is causing the slowness. It runs and calculates when the database is opened
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby ksherman » Sun Apr 07, 2019 8:57 pm

the5krunner wrote:It's the TRAININGLOAD PLUGIN that is causing the slowness. It runs and calculates when the database is opened
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you mean that TL recalculates the entire logbook each time?

Interestingly I have roughly 9 years data. Size is only 164,434 KB for 2,925 activities.
But only 5.3M GPS points due to no GPS on most swimming, gym activities.
And 13.5M data track points. No power data. I use HR TRIMP because of my activity mix. My load time is 12 secs to taskbar icon, 32 seconds to ST open for business.
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Re: [ST3] Performance on startup

Postby the5krunner » Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:58 am

ksherman wrote:
the5krunner wrote:It's the TRAININGLOAD PLUGIN that is causing the slowness. It runs and calculates when the database is opened
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you mean that TL recalculates the entire logbook each time?

Interestingly I have roughly 9 year's data. Size is only 164,434 KB for 2,925 activities.
But only 5.3M GPS points due to no GPS on most swimming, gym activities.
And 13.5M data track points. No power data. I use HR TRIMP because of my activity mix. My load time is 12 secs to taskbar icon, 32 seconds to ST open for business.


yep. it looks like it. I don't know for sure (I could maybe email him I guess)

turn it off. makes a massive difference to me..although obviously I want it each time I use st3.1 !!!
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